Quote by: RookieCoach

Kai , Great points you added.

From your stats you posted earlier on this topic (turnovers etc)

How do these stats affect the style and the systems that you coach in Finland ?

Do you work TRANSITION games each practice session ?

Reading all these stats on turnovers makes me think as a coach if you have the skill and speed on you team pressure is a must.

RookieCoach

Transition games have been part of FIHA's development program since the 90's when Westerlund was head of coaching of Finnish Ice Hockey Association. In the late 90's FIHA added The ABC's Of International Ice Hockey to it's development program and to be introduced to coaches in FIHA's coaching clinics.

Kai , Great points you added.

From your stats you posted earlier on this topic (turnovers etc)

How do these stats affect the style and the systems that you coach in Finland ?

Do you work TRANSITION games each practice session ?

Reading all these stats on turnovers makes me think as a coach if you have the skill and speed on you team pressure is a must.

RookieCoach

Tom,
What age groups would you start using your language ( 3 game situation and 4 playing roles ) for communication ?

What about teaching or communicating by numbers ?

What skills do you find young players lack in today's game aside from skating , puck handling , shooting etc?

I find many coaches don't teach puck protection , defensive side positioning , stick on stick etc.
Once players get to body checking players chase all over the ice for the big hit , forgetting about positioning or containing the opponent.

Thoughts from other coaches on skills we need to teach ?

RookieCoach

Tom ,
Funny you should bring this discussion back up on the board. I went back to it last week and had a quick look at it again.

The information that yourself , Dean , Kai , Dave , Eric and others posted was a great discussion and full of information.

Coaches , if you go over all the stats posted it will make you think of how you take them to practice and what areas need work.

Tom , Do all your players understand the game three game situations (0-1-2) and the four player roles before they step on the ice ?

Do your players understand the importance of transition as a team before the season starts and do you stress the point of quick transition ?

Hockey has become a TRANSITION GAME , but do coaches work on transition games or drills in practice

Once again I have picked up Tom's Book 2 - Hockey Coaching ABC's and going through it before the season starts for probably the forth time.
Great book Tom.

RookieCoach

OK, RK Asked me to post this here on this thread (regarding PP) so here it is...

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My Master's was based on Bjorn Kinding's work. He took PP stats from the 1991 World Championships in Turku Finland. There were 100 analyzed PP's - 28 goals were scored (0.78%).

The summary numbers indicate success % for the different plays:

Half Boards 4%
On the Rush 8 %
End boards 13%
Points 75%

To score 17 goals from the point, the teams only gave up puck control a total of 13 times.

To score a single goal initiated from the half boards, it needed a total of 31 losses of puck control!

Knowing that puck control is one main source of success and a team can only afford to lose the puck once or twice per PP, it will take 15 pp's to score one goal this way. In other words, if your PP is built on plays from the half boards, you shouldn't expect a better average than 6.6%!

On the PP, the plays from the points produce:

61-75% of all goals;
67% of all first class scoring chances;
76% of all second class scoring chances, and;
23% of all puck control losses.

To create a scoring chance, the player on the point has these 4 BEST options:

Shoot or pass from an area straight in front of the net (between the faceoff dots):

1. on net;
2. to create a rebound ;
3. for a tip in and;
4. on a screened goalie.

The most and best scoring chances are produced by a point play from an area straight in front of the net (between the faceoff dots). (Bjorn removed 4 questionable goals and added an unclassifiable goal to the PP category) Ultimately, point shots from between the dots were the source of 110 out of 188 scoring chances and 15 out of 28 PP goals... or 59% of all PP scoring chances and 54% of all PP goals are initiated by a point play from between the faceoff dots. The importance that the point plays in between the dots is tremendous!

So to summarize, 'all' you have to do to achieve an effective PP is:

Collectively control the puck ... move the puck to the point ... have players screening in front of the net... and SHOOT! How simple is that?

BUT... as seen below, how much time should one worry about / actually practice the PP when compared to even strength situations... and all the potential times for TRANSITIONS to occur? You be the judge - and allocate your practice time (and coaching worry) proportionately ... errrrr I mean wisely!!!

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From an earlier, related post on transition:

forum/viewtopic.php?showtopic=2978

A few quotes from Bjorn:

"In top international play, for instance the final game of the 1994 World Cup, puck possession changed from one team to the other 7.7 times per minute. There's just no time to get the whole team 100 percent into defending before there's a chance to attack again... you are constantly playing "transition hockey" "

"In 1990, I studied and analyzed the transition in 'modern' ice hockey. The study included games from the World Cup Pools A and B, the Swiss and German playoffs and the NHL. The result showed that 60 percent of all goals were scored on the transition, which means, that almost three times as many goals are scored on transition as on the power play (23 percent). But how many teams practice transition three times as much as they practice the power play?"

"If we focus on play with equal numbers of players on both sides, then 88 percent of all goals are scored on transitions... 94 percent of all first class scoring chances are created on transitions."

"...if you want to be good in the game of hockey you have to be great in the game of transition."

Age categories - Hockey Canada after the 2001 age changes:

Mini Mite (ages 1–2)
Mite (ages 3–4)
Tyke (ages 5–6)
Novice (ages 7–8)
Atom (ages 9–10)
Pee Wee (ages 11–12)
Bantam (ages 13–14)
Midget (ages 15–17)
Juvenile (ages 18–20)

In the United States, USA Hockey designates the following levels:

Mini Mite (ages 5-6) (Levels A)
Mite (ages 7-8) (Levels AA, A, B)
Squirt (ages 9–10) (Levels AAA, AA, A, B)
Peewee (ages 11–12) (Levels AAA, AA, A, B)
Bantam (ages 13–14) (Levels AAA, AA, A, B)
Midget Minor 16 and Under (ages 15–16) (Levels AAA, AA, junior varsity highschool-B)
Midget Major 18 and Under (ages 15–18) (Levels AAA, AA, varsity high school-B)

In Finland, the Finnish Ice Hockey Association roughly categorizes minor hockey players to under school-ages and school-ages. Children over 16 are considered as juniors, although the youngest juniors are still at the school-age. Minor and junior hockey levels are:

G- and F-minors (age 11 and younger)
E-minors (ages 12 to 13)
D-minors (ages 14 to 15)
C-juniors (age 16 and younger)
B-juniors (age 18 and younger)
A-juniors (age 20 and younger)

http ://en. wikipedia.org/wiki/Minor_ice_hockey

Interesting! I will look at it more over the weekend. One game is not a large enough sample size but it gets one thinking; plus it would mean the most to the particular team you were recording for... along with your observations.

I recorded Tom's skill academy practice on Tuesday and then a Bantam Div 3 team practice last night. I am going to do an analysis from the bantam practice (1/2 ice) as I am mentoring the coach. Anything noteworthy, I will share under one of these threads...

Quote by: RookieCoach

Tom, Yes that is the drill I was talking about. It is a good drill , good for the D joining the rush.
It is a little faster pace than the DT 100 D Joins the play and F Backchecks.( although a little difference in skill level between videos) But this drill DT 100 Contains a few more elements. Breakout , support , Backchecking , D joining the rush , and a 2 on2 low.
By the way , Dean does use drills !!
I will definitely give the Dt100 Backchecking drill a try.
Thanks
RK

AARRGH! Damn you for noticing RK!

"Give 'em what they want" - GUILTY!

Yes, I had to de-train my mind and stoop to an all-time low level to work with the pros... never again! They wondered if I would come back this year, but all they wanted was flow drills, etc. so I said no. I don't care how much they pay! These 'drills' were a hybrid in that they were more game-like and we kept score... even so I am still not off the hook!

Quote by: TomM

I like to use two colours in practice and my team just got their brand new reversible jerseys with the team logo and numbers. I have pinnies in case I want to do a Kings Score type of rotation or divide the team into units. At practice we have half the F and half the D and one goalie in green and the other half in white. This makes playing SAG, games and transition games etc. easy.

I just posted todays practice where I am introducing a full ice backchecking transition game as well as a full ice transition game where the D joins the attack and the F backchecks. The forwards will play a quick transition game where the situations vary from 1-1 to 3-3, 1-2, 1-3, 3-1, 3-2, 2-2. I will tell how many new players leave when they are passed the puck. The practice is attached here and in the diary of a season. I post these because I have been using games and transiton games for a long time. When Sean my asst. who works with the D has them Natalie my goalie coach has the G for 10' each while I have one in one goal for a quick transiton game with the F's. I will move that game up to the top of the circles to reduce 'time and space.' We will keep track of who wins the most and the others will pick up the pucks.

Team play review on the sports court tomorrow and individual and team defense focus on Thursday which is our last ice time before the two weekend games.

So games can be used to practice all of the skills and the w/r ratio is adjusted by how many players join the play next. At my school skills session yesterday they played games with rules like only backward skating, baggo and two pass with the added rule that everyone must score before anyone can score a second goal.

By using games you reverse the 80% of the minutes standing in line in the average drills based practice (studies in both Canada and Europe show that in a drills based practice the players are moving 7-12 minutes and standing in line or listening to the coach 48-53 minutes. (that is why bag skates are needed-the players have hardly moved) A game based practice has players moving most of the time and only waiting so they can recover for the next rep. (you don't need to skate them at the end- they already have had a great work out)

Kai, how do you puck diagrams into the postings. I haven't figured that out yet.
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The transition game with the F backchecking and D joining is too complicated the way the diagram has it. Start with 1-1 giving passive support above the top of the circles and build from there. Need a new diagram.

Tom, I have used a similar type of drill F backchecking and D joining the rush. The one you posted on your Daily Drill Section Eight yesterday as a Transition game contains more roles being used . I will give this one a try soon , as I am going to have a backchecking theme practice in the near future.
Tom posted the video link on his Daily Drill section Eight.
Check it out.

RookieCoach
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RK - http://www.hockeycoachingabcs.com/mediagallery/media.php?s=20101007154527928 is a link showing Dean doing this with a lot of the Flames and other pro's in a pre season camp last year. The transition game requires a breakout and low zone play.
Some of the players at college played for me for 3-4-5 years and were so used to the transition games that the supporting players would join low and make it a 3-3 instead of being passive above the circles. I will attach the pdf of the drill. I think it is the one you mention.

OK don't laugh. Remember, I don't own a cell phone...!

Here is my attempt to modify one of Kai's diagrams using powerpoint and saved as a .pdf... may I present to all the "Figure 1: Transition Success" diagram found on page 76 of Bjorn Kinding's 1994 Advanced II Presentation, "TRANSITION". This is the one I tried to describe near the start of this forum thread.

HAHAHAHAHA .... it worked! There's mud in yer eye, technology!

Quote by: Eric

Great discussion guys..

Tom,

What is the title of the booklet and video and do you know where I could get it? Looks like it would be a nice addition to a lot of the games already on the site.

Great diagrams on transition stats. Hearing the numbers are always one thing but seeing them can touch another chord for some, myself included.

Eric,

The booklet is "Transition - From Game to Practice" by Erkka Westerlund, 1994. Another one is "Transition - Defense to Offense" by Slava Lener, 1992. Both are available for sale through the Hockey Canada Resource Centre. They are about $20 and I see they 'updated' them for 2010 (which means new pictures on the front... hard to say anything has changed on the inside!) These books are worthwhile, in my opinion.

http://www2.hockeycanada.ca/breakaway/coach-s-library/cbreakaway-ccoachlibrary-p1.html

I also recommend the 1998 and 2001 Advanced II Proceedings - each $34.95.

The rest don't really tickle my fancy. ("40 of the Best" was the one I did with Tom and Mike... but it is DRILLS! ACK What was I thinking back then...!!!!)

Great discussion guys..

Tom,

What is the title of the booklet and video and do you know where I could get it? Looks like it would be a nice addition to a lot of the games already on the site.

Great diagrams on transition stats. Hearing the numbers are always one thing but seeing them can touch another chord for some, myself included.

To answer Tom's discussion question on forechecks, I think the 2-1-2 w/pinch on a wide rim would be a great forecheck to run given the numbers on turnovers and generating offense. I think running the most aggressive 4-check is the most exciting to play. I think what makes it most difficult to use is that lack of patience coaches have at times. The longer teams stick with it the less breakdowns they would see.

"Safe is Death" Tampa Bay 2004

OK Kai, this week I will see if I can import this into Powerpoint and draw those lines I was trying to describe, then re-post... thanks!

Quote by: RookieCoach

Thanks again for your input on these statistics. I don't know where Dean finds all these articles but it's great reading and learning material.

One thing I will say at times it's overwhelming trying to implement a new type of practice from the old traditional way. I seem to be the type of coach that must understand it completely before hit the or try new things. I like for the players too think I know what I'm talking about.

Thanks

RookieCoach

RK,

Thanks for the email - I will be in touch in a day or two... gotta take the kids out for Hallowe'en tonight!

I read extensively and have been coaching since the early 1980's... so I have lots of binders, 'friends in high and low places... and all levels in between' so articles are not hard to find!

Nice to have some feedback that someone reads them - thank you!

I must admit, some articles that I post reflect my own biases (particularly on hazing, abuse, general stupidity because I think it is our moral obligation of coaches to put an end to it! Not only was my dad a victim of sexual abuse from a trusted boy scout leader, I was bullied and hazed as a player myself... Why? How did this make me 'part of the team?' I still get pissed thinking about it and I sure as HELL don't want this to happen to ANY kids under my watch as an educator / coach... or happen to my OWN kids if they choose to play. (Tom, I know you have some stories to tell - I will leave that up to you.)

I get depressed reading all of theses depressing stories; but I think they need to be made an issue until they go away... which I hope they will! "If we ignore our history, we are doomed to repeat our past." It is tougher to find 'good news' for the Inspirational forum, but I hope it somewhat balances all the doom and gloom.) Others I post because I think they might be of interest to the regular readers of the site. Maybe someone will find something to 'spark' their interest? I hope that whatever I post, it has a special meaning for someone out there... I like to try to inspire people; get them to think.

RK, I was overwhelmed by all these new ideas and methodologies at first, too. I would say I went through a period of time where it was a process... try one thing and then retreat back to my comfort zone... then try another; or tweak something... then I had an epiphany, then settled back into more of a process. As the YEARS go by (and with John always talking to me daily), I grow bolder and now I have firmly "crossed over" to the "Game is the best teacher" side and have no regrets. I have daily "Ah Ha" moments when I do our Game Intelligence activities. This site helps me by allowing me to express some of them; and other questions / comments by others help me / challenge me to answer them using my methodology and 'where I am right now as a coach' on the trajectory of my coaching evolution. Yes, I am cognizant of how I introduce it, but my firm belief in it being 'the right way' and my self-confidence based on much trial and error, allows me to do so. Most players / coaches, if you show them the individual benefits and how it can help their team, they will buy in. The key is to get them to participate in it. Whenever possible, as above, I start with dryland first...

This 'Coaching REVOLUTION' takes time... I had the good fortune of a daily mentor (John the Colombian) and people like Tom, and several other coaches at various levels (college, university, pro, international) who I could turn to in times of indecision or doubt. If you don't have that... your (R)evolution may take longer; or not happen at all! Everybody needs a mentor of some sort!

Keep experimenting RK. It's OK to make mistakes. That's how we advance ourselves and society.

This is why I think we need to do a GAME INTELLIGENCE / ABC's COACHING CLINIC here in Calgary (and invite people on this forum to attend)... any interest? JOhn and I just did one a month ago and are looking to do another in the spring. (I would say lets do it in Hawaii, or somewhere warmer, but in Calgary, we are well-connected: we can get facilities and access to players to 'experiment with' during the clinic.) But if some of you think we could do something in your local area, email me. If we could get a bunch of players and coaches who could pay a fee, this would help offset the costs of John, myself and Tom coming to your area...!

Quote by: TomM

Rookie Coach and Dean.

I share my material such as the transition games that you refer to. I would like to read the discussion about them.

How have you used them? What adjustments have you made? How did the players adapt to them???? Do they seem to make a difference in the way your team plays in regulation games?

Tom, As I mentioned earlier in this post somewhere , I'm fairly new to your site. After purchasing your book (Hockey Coaching ABC's Book 2) it has made me think about game situation roles and game phases. Your book contains a different way of looking and reading the game than the typical hockey book OR course.

I mentioned too Dean that the DT transition drills on this site caught my attention the most. I guess that's is why I asked the question about Statistics - for critical area's on the ice. Referring to turnovers and the transition part of the game. Some of these stats that have been posted here by yourself ,Dean Kai , Dave really have to make a coach look at this part of the game.

Last practice that I ran for a local team , I used D100 2/3 s ice Attack-defend- rest games. Also Dean suggested to me about card240 of your book and card 241 when I was asking about backchecking games.
The flow was great , the players picked up on these games quickly. It was an introduction for them and myself running these games. I would stress the quickness and supporting player making himself available sooner next time , but for the first time all went well. I will definitely try them again.
I have used foe a few years now a game at the end of practice. Box game with jokers at the point. 2on2 but the rule is before they can attack they must pass to their joker who now joins in for a 3on2 , 3 on 3 etc, Players for some reason love this game.

Thanks again for your input on these statistics. I don't know where Dean finds all these articles but it's great reading and learning material.
One thing I will say at times it's overwhelming trying to implement a new type of practice from the old traditional way. I seem to be the type of coach that must understand it completely before hit the or try new things. I like for the players too think I know what I'm talking about.
Thanks

RookieCoach
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RK, it takes a while to get used to "Looking at old things through New Eyes." I met Juhani in 85 when he was brought here to do a coaching symposium at the university. I was head coach of a college mens team at the time. I knew team play etc. but my practices were pretty standard drills centred and not very good. Juuso was only here for two weeks but in a 40 hour seminar you get a lot of info. I found that he was running hockey practices in much the same way I taught my PE classes. He also was a PE teacher and had players like the Koivu brothers and Kirprosov in his hockey class. He asked me to start writing the manual with him and I got more familiar with using games, tournament, modified rules etc. in pracitce. Erkka came here in the early 90's and much the same thing happened with transition games.

The thing that really forced me to use these ideas was I went to a new school and now had double PE classes. 48-60 students at once in a small gym for 13 years. It was become more efficient or die. The model of small teams, tournaments, modified rules made it easy to teach these large groups. There is a video of one of the classes in the files section. You can see how many kid's are in the small space.

Good luck with it! I enjoy reading the discussions you start because they stimulate me to look for workable solutions to the problems mentioned.

An aside is that I got a call from Finland this morning to inform me that one of the 93 born players I coached with the Red Bulls in Austria has just been named to the Finnish U19 team. They play a tournament in Switzerland and 2 of the D from the U19 team will join the U20 team at the World Championships here just after Christmass. So go Otso go.